Yotah´s RS Cup "Nurburgring Edition" -> 204hp F4R832 swap.

[AS_BO]

Blown Away......... This is going to be LEGEN........ Wait for it........... DARY!!

 

[mwalsh]

Pure motorsport do an option for camber adjustment on the wish bone, if extreme degrees are needed

 

[yotah1]

Are you still going to run a Servo with bias adjustment or going for a full pedal box?

I drove my dad's new toy (106 GTI Stage Car) back from Gretna the other day with a Tilton Pedal box in it with no ABS or servo, have to say it was an experience.

It does give you good feel and you can learn the modulation but definetly grows the braking leg

Not decided yet but I might opt for a TB&C pedal box if I can find a used one or some like this in order to just have everything fitted together properly. I'm meeting the guys at Teichmann Racing this weekend at the VLN race at the Nürburgring to chat with them regarding the ECU mapping and maybe some parts.

Mwalsh, no extra camber needed, 2° or so is definitely enough on the Twingo. I used to run a 3° setup in 2012 but that proved to be too much, stressing the tires inner shoulders too much on the high speed straights, and not even getting everything flat on the tarmac in the heaviest corners of the track.

 

[singlespeed]

Pure motorsport do an option for camber adjustment on the wish bone, if extreme degrees are needed

Probably the biggest benefits of the Pure Motorsport wishbones are correcting/raising the roll centre for the MK2 Clio and stiffening the subframe. You could dial in more castor too, so I'd class more camber as a minor benefit as there's already ways of getting more than enough camber :? The 133 has different hubs and wishbones, so the bottom ball joint on the 133 is already a lot lower than the 1*2, so we probably roll centres closer to the Clio Cup racers already

The kit may work on the 133 to compensate for lowering the ride height, but I don't think it will fit inside 15's. It may also clash with the anti roll bar.

 

[mwalsh]

Sorry was meaning powerflex, they do a Bush/mount in the front side of the wishbone to allow camber change.
Not sure exactly how it works. Bot sure on the idea of it to

3 degrees, wow. Think I have mine set to 1.5 as my max so far. Don't think I've got the experience for anything more at the moment

 

[singlespeed]

Sorry was meaning powerflex, they do a Bush/mount in the front side of the wishbone to allow camber change.
Not sure exactly how it works. Bot sure on the idea of it to

3 degrees, wow. Think I have mine set to 1.5 as my max so far. Don't think I've got the experience for anything more at the moment

OK, two different things :?

I'll be finding out if the Powerflex bushes fit 133 wishbones once I'm home. A set should have arrived today and I've only another week left here.
The bushes have the mounting hole off center, allowing the pivot point to be moved inboard /outboard for camber adjustment. I'm more interested in moving the pivot point upwards and the possibility of gaining a bit more castor.

 

[mazmaz]

Mwalsh, no extra camber needed, 2° or so is definitely enough on the Twingo. I used to run a 3° setup in 2012 but that proved to be too much, stressing the tires inner shoulders too much on the high speed straights, and not even getting everything flat on the tarmac in the heaviest corners of the track.

do you mesure camber by yourself?

I supect to have to much on mine, since the guy put the new front chock (tyre are completly ruin inside , didn't happen before)
but don't want to pay a garage to check that ^^

 

[singlespeed]

Mwalsh, no extra camber needed, 2° or so is definitely enough on the Twingo. I used to run a 3° setup in 2012 but that proved to be too much, stressing the tires inner shoulders too much on the high speed straights, and not even getting everything flat on the tarmac in the heaviest corners of the track.

do you mesure camber by yourself?

I supect to have to much on mine, since the guy put the new front chock (tyre are completly ruin inside , didn't happen before)
but don't want to pay a garage to check that ^^

I measure my camber myself, using a spirit level with adjustable bubbles.

Find a vertical door frame and that should be zero
Measure 570mm up the door frame
Over that 570mm, 10mm would be 1deg and 20mm will be close to 2deg
(The simple maths breaks down and isn't very accurate above two degrees, but close enough below that. You can work it out correctly if you wish. It also needs a level area for the car to sit on otherwise you will just be measuring the angle of the hill)

Place the spirit level against the wheel, then set the adjustable bubble to record the angle. Compare this to the door frame measurements to get an angle.

Or, set your adjustable bubble as required and then use the spirit level against the wheel, then adjust the camber to get mid bubble.

 

[oscar]

https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Trackace-Laser-Wheel-Alignment-Tracking-System-Trackrite-Camber-Castor-Gauge-/370958430326?pt=UK_Measuring_Tools_Levels&hash=item565ed87076

this bad boys really good for it's price and is actually accurate. one of the boys in work bought this for track days, and we tested it's accuracy against the workshops fancy four wheel laser alignment ramp thingy lol and it was actually just less than 1 minute (so less thant the 1' claimed) certainly fantastic value for money and over a few years more than pays for itself if we assume £30-50 for a good tracking / basic geo check +++ for camber set ups and adjustments etc!

ironically the spirit bubble method is still used as backups in some workshops, even good old renault we used an old dunlop spirit bubble camber guage and it was spot on to be honest for road set ups. not much use for track set ups like neil said, getting to 2* + of camber it becomes inacurate, certainly handy if you already have a spirit level of sorts

 

[Spitfire1]

Sorry was meaning powerflex, they do a Bush/mount in the front side of the wishbone to allow camber change.
Not sure exactly how it works. Bot sure on the idea of it to

3 degrees, wow. Think I have mine set to 1.5 as my max so far. Don't think I've got the experience for anything more at the moment

I have the standard Powerflex bushes which I'm fitting to mine (1.2 16V which is the same as the GT) I'm just waiting for the arms to come back from nylon coating, but they do fit very well, so that means the camber adjustable version will fit the standard arms as well as they use the same metal insert.

I'm running -2.00 deg on the front but using camber bolts, I think this will change once I've fitted the Powerflex bush as the current Renault bush is way to soft and moves all over the place.

Rob.

 

[Spitfire1]

https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Trackace-Laser-Wheel-Alignment-Tracking-System-Trackrite-Camber-Castor-Gauge-/370958430326?pt=UK_Measuring_Tools_Levels&hash=item565ed87076

I use / have the camber / caster gauge - works well and as you said pretty good value for money.

 

[yotah1]

The car is at the workshop

The "mechanical" part of the work should be completed this week, swapping the engine and box, getting the new pipes in and all that, doing some mods inside the interior also.
The windows were ordered last week and will arrive this weekend, along with a set of semi slicks Avon next week. I'm getting on the phone today with Sybele to order my ECU and wiring loom. I've had a very good discussion with a french guru of that kind of stuff (maybe 2-3 guys in the world have the same programming knowledge as he does for Renault cars) and he explained me that the ignition part of the system can pretty much be a stand alone, allowing me to keep my interior electronics (heating, turn signals and so on) fully working with the original Twingo wiring system. That should also help us keep the ABS if we still want it and simplify a lot of things. Biggest part coming up will be the engine tuning on a dyno, and that's going to cost a mountain of money, even with very competent guys from the RoadRunner Racing team at the Nürburgring.

I'll update as soon as I receive some news and photos.

 

[yotah1]

ECU and wiring ordered, work starts tomorrow on the car

 

[oscar]

would be interesting to see you go side by side with Chris Ingrams R2 that'll still be my favourite twingo of them all, it's so aggressive and gnarly. best of luck with this build Ant, i cannot wait to see the outcome and i hope it all goes smooth

 

[mazmaz]

R2 cost something like 55.000€ xD (you need sponsors or really rich daddy)
don't understand the comparaison

 

[oscar]

R2 cost something like 55.000€ xD (you need sponsors or really rich daddy)
don't understand the comparaison

200 bhp for both cars near enough, fancy pedals and gearbox set up with the R2 set up for acceleration rather than top speed, stripped out for competition use ... there certainly are comparisons to be made, in the sense that you can do what Anthony is doing and achieve close to the same kinds of results as an R2 for much less money. i cannot wait to see the outcome of this

 

[yotah1]

You forgot "totally awful to drive on the road" whereas mine will be a peach

 

[oscar]

You forgot "totally awful to drive on the road" whereas mine will be a peach

+1

 

[user 980]

I can't wait to see how this progresses. All the best and hope it all goes smoothly.

Lots of photos and information required

 

[yotah1]

The work started this morning. I'll have some photos soon.

I've ordered the Sybele ECU and AIM dash, as well as the new Avon ZZR tires that will be delivered tomorrow. The windows arrive in 2 days.
The shocks are the last remaining element to be delivered in order to have everything ready for the build.