Suspension Lower Balljoint Rubbers

[nagshead 77]

ok so just an update on my case with Renault. Car went in to Renault be inspected today so as expected the problem was split bottom ball joint boot on both sides which have led to busted ball joints. So as we know the hole arm has to be replaced,total cost of job £555 of your queens English pounds. The arms are £150 a pop. Renault uk offered to pay 70% which I accepted so total cost to me £150ish.
So I got the car back tonight and its pulling to left so called them straight away and its gonna be going back and I am less then happy after 1, having to pay for this job in 1st place and for 2 ,its now not right as its pulling left and gonna shag my tyres out if left.
I am now off to write a complaint to Renault to see what they think of me having to pay for a job on my car that shouldn't have needed doing at 17000 miles and about me getting my car back after a job costing nearly £600 and it still not being right.
I asked if the same poor quality boot rubber had been fitted and they couldn't answer,also the arms are made of lightweight aluminium and not steel and the joint is machine pressed in, this apparently is why the whole arm and joint has to be replaced.

 

[maggi200]

What? How do they get that?!

So £150 a side. Undo 3 bolts. Remove item. Redo 3 bolts. Repeat on the other side. How does that equate to that much in labour?!

I hope they're doing a full geometry check following that for that price.

 

[nagshead 77]

R they eck as like, they have us by balls but if Renault uk hadnt of payed Id now b nearly 600 lighter ,Im not happy car has to go bk at sum point when I can get it in ....a letter will be following,..until they do a recall on these we are screwed,only then will we get are money refunded.

 

[nagshead 77]

£144.57 each to be precise

 

[oscar]

seems right maggi in terms of dealership extortion at least if you consider that technical data job time equates to around 1.5 hours per side to include a wheel alignment and geometry check. 150 x 2 sides at wholesale (300) if you take the extra 250 for labour and further checks, it works out to closer to 1.7 hours they have charged for per side which is bloody well ridiculous when you can do this job in ten minutes before geometry

 

[user 980]

So in a few years when ruk stop contributing, you'd be better of sourcing + fittonf the arms yourself, and then taking it somewhere for an alignment/geo set up? The dealers rob ruk blind and I don't blame them if ruk are willing to cough up repeatedly rather than fix common issues

 

[oscar]

So in a few years when ruk stop contributing, you'd be better of sourcing + fittonf the arms yourself, and then taking it somewhere for an alignment/geo set up? The dealers rob ruk blind and I don't blame them if ruk are willing to cough up repeatedly rather than fix common issues

yes mark pretty much, it's not much more than a few bolts really and doesn't take much skill to do the job which is a plus. back in the day measuring camber and castor angles was just a bubble in a spirit level zero'd on a true vertical surface, with the castor turned through 40 degrees and the camber guage was zero'd and placed on the rim face, it was that simple! you can however do your alignment (toe in, to out) yourself with a fair amount of accuracy mark with some string etc and a lot of patience

+ now that you have the twingo workshop manual, you can find the tolerances yourself for toe in toe out alignment and then do that yourself to save you 20-30 quid!

back to topic though sorry, neil are you any closer to sourcing ball joints that will retro fit directly into your arms?

 

[singlespeed]

back in the day measuring camber and castor angles was just a bubble in a spirit level zero'd on a true vertical surface, with the castor turned through 40 degrees and the camber guage was zero'd and placed on the rim face, it was that simple! you can however do your alignment (toe in, to out) yourself with a fair amount of accuracy mark with some string etc and a lot of patience

+ now that you have the twingo workshop manual, you can find the tolerances yourself for toe in toe out alignment and then do that yourself to save you 20-30 quid!

back to topic though sorry, neil are you any closer to sourcing ball joints that will retro fit directly into your arms?

That's how I do my geometry. A short spirit level or camber/caster and two cheap long ones for toe (fairly rigid so less fiddly than string). A dozen tyewraps to hold the levels onto the wheel and a tape measure to measure the angle.

I'm about 60 miles off getting any further. 60 miles offshore and ten days left.

 

[maggi200]

So after chasing as it's been a week the answer is:

Nothing will be done until the garage has inspected the vehicle again.

I have no faith in this and it's taken a week for that answer. I am quite unhappy at this, as you would expect. That was always going to be the answer so why has it only come after a week, and why did I have to chase it?

 

[nagshead 77]

My car went bak in the day after the repair as i said was pulling badly Left because the wheels hadnt been aligned,upon its return the "technician" said they Took it out and it was Fine but then he said we have alligned the wheels..wtf? I then Took it out and its 100% a ok,as it should of been we came out the garage. I have now sent Renault a complaint email with my thoughts a nd it didnt make Good reading for them,I am now awaiting a response,will have wait and see if they reply.

 

[set69]

wishbone is here, heat reflectors next week

so on new balljoint is written OCAP UKK CR, on rubber of balljoint code is 1211447

 

[set69]

pics of new/old

tommorow i think ill find some time to remoce balljoint so i can take all measures

 

[waitey]

My car went bak in the day after the repair as i said was pulling badly Left because the wheels hadnt been aligned,upon its return the "technician" said they Took it out and it was Fine but then he said we have alligned the wheels..wtf? I then Took it out and its 100% a ok,as it should of been we came out the garage. I have now sent Renault a complaint email with my thoughts a nd it didnt make Good reading for them,I am now awaiting a response,will have wait and see if they reply.

Renault never get the alignment right anyway and its something any garage can do for ~£30 or a specialist who knows alignments inside out and use laser alignment tend to charge ~£50 for front wheels or ~£90 for all 4 depending if your rears can be adjusted which in a twingo can't without camber shims.

 

[abrahams133]

Hi peeps. Just been for mot, due end of Nov, failed on ball joint (as expected). On the notice the chap has stated "front lower suspension arm has excessive play in a ball joint" and also stated "track rod end ball joint has excessive play". Just wondering if these are on and the same?

Next step book in with renault for them to have a look and I'm hoping contribute a little to the repair, although well out of warranty so we'll see.

Do these things amount to the same would you say? New lower arm needed I'm assuming!

Thanks, Dave. : )

 

[singlespeed]

Hi peeps. Just been for mot, due end of Nov, failed on ball joint (as expected). On the notice the chap has stated "front lower suspension arm has excessive play in a ball joint" and also stated "track rod end ball joint has excessive play". Just wondering if these are on and the same?

Next step book in with renault for them to have a look and I'm hoping contribute a little to the repair, although well out of warranty so we'll see.

Do these things amount to the same would you say? New lower arm needed I'm assuming!

Thanks, Dave. : )

Theres two balljoints either side of the car:-
One is the lower ball joint and its part of the lower suspension arm and allows the wheel/hub/suspension assembly to pivot up/down and turn around the end of the suspension arm.

The second is the Track rod end which allows rotation and pivoting at the ends of the steering input, as its arranged like this>>
Hub assembly(wheel) - Track rod end - Track rod - Steering rack - Track rod - Track rod end - Hub assembly(wheel)

Quite a simple bit to replace the TRE and shouldn't be too much more expensive as the tracking will be needing reset for the wishbone/lower arm.

Lower arm balljoint would be the usual one mentioned in this thread

 

[abrahams133]

Thanks for that! Not mechanically minded at all!! : )

 

[ollieallen]

Had my car up over last weekend to change the suspension back to standard (KW coilies were getting horribly knocky and rattley and will be sent back to K-Tec soon) and my lower ball joint rubbers are definitely split Still yet to phone RUK to see what can be done but I'm beginning to get more sceptical the more people's comments I read!

 

[oscar]

it's really ridiculous now to be fair, you shouldn't have to be replacing these every x thousand miles. an e-petition should be created for this forum and sent off to renault-uk and once they have 2,000 wolves at their door maybe they will listen.

 

[waitey]

it's really ridiculous now to be fair, you shouldn't have to be replacing these every x thousand miles. an e-petition should be created for this forum and sent off to renault-uk and once they have 2,000 wolves at their door maybe they will listen.

I doubt you'll get 2000 people with the same problem on a twingo to do that seeing as there aren't many on the road.

Plus every car has its problems and twingos are definitely not an exception, why not approach a company to make an uprated part as you'll have better luck that way and one last thing, its a common problem so if people researched the car before they bought one they would know its a common issue by now and should put up with it.

 

[oscar]

it's not an acknowledged common pattern failure in their technical bulletins, that's the point in letting renault know via an owners group of a common failure pattern that they haven't picked up on yet. it really doesn't cost anything for renault to inform the manufacturer of the joint that the boot's split and rendered the ball joint humped on what appears to be many a 133. but an interesting point to throw into the fold is that i'm 2008 / 50,000miles in and still on factory ball joints and boots to the best of my knowledge, i at least can confirm i have done 28,000miles on them from when i bought the car and they are still in tip top shape after having the backside booted out of it daily. wood has been touched firmly